X10 PROBLEM

[steve]

I HAVE A X10 MOTION SENSOR IN MY HALLWAY AND RECIEVER IN THE THEATOR ROOM IT CAN TURN ON BOTH SETS OF THEATOR ROOM LIGHTS BUT HAL DOESN'T SEEM TO BE ABLE WORK THE LIGHTS THE SWITCHES ARE SWITCHLINCS AND I HAVE MANY OTHER LIGHT IN THE HOUSE AND NO PROBLEMS FROM THEM SO HOW COME THE MOTION SENSOR CAN TURN THEM ON AND OFF AND HAL CANT?

[AutomatedOutlet]

It might be a phase issue that your transceiver and HAL are on different phases. Do you have a phase couple installed?

[Greg from HAL Support]

FAQ: I'm having trouble getting HAL to control some of my X10 devices.
It can turn a light on but not off. Sometimes a light can be
controlled, other times it can not.


The fact that HAL can control some X10 devices but not others probably
means that the software and your X10 interface are working fine. So the
X10 signals are getting on to the powerline, but for some reason it is
not controlling some of your lights.

Since this is an X10 protocol issue you can also look to Automation
Distributors/Dealers for assistances as they deal with these issues
everyday since. A distributor will probably have a web site with
trouble shooting help and hardware. You can also usually email and call
for assistance. For a list of some automations catalogs go to the
Dealer section of our web site www.automatedliving.com to the
Distributor link. This will show places that sell HAL. Most also sell
X10 hardware and have tech support for trouble shooting such issue. If
you do not want to trouble shoot the issue yourself you could have a HAL
or X10 dealer/installer try and track down the problem. For HAL dealers
you can contact sales@automatedliving.com for dealers in your area
(please include where you live and any major cities nearby).


Here are some troubleshooting items that we have gathered that can help
you figure out what these X10 problems might be.

One common problem people see is related to your electrical legs in your
home. Electricity comes into your house at 220 volts and is split into
two legs (also referred to as phases) of 110 volt. The X10 signal can
not transmit from one electrical leg to the other leg. So you will plug
the HAL X10 interface into one of the legs. This means that you can
only control X10 devices on this leg. You can not control devices on
the other leg of electrical wiring. If you do not wish to control
devices on one certain leg of electrical wiring then just plug your X10
interface into the leg of electrical wiring that has all the devices you
want to control.

But typically people want X10 control on both legs. So one way to
determine if you have a leg problem is by turning on a 220 volt device
(dryer, stove, etc). When one of these 220 volt devices are on the two
legs are bridged and the X10 signal can cross (however sometimes these
220 volt devices can cause X10 noise which then weakens the X10 signal
so it is not a fail proof method). So if you can turn on your dryer and
then control these other X10 devices it would appear to be a leg
problem. Another way to determine if the X10 device is on a different
leg them your X10 interface is to look at the breaker box. If you know
who the legs are split you should be able to determine which breakers
are on which legs. While not universal, often the breakers alternate.
So breaker 1 is on leg 1, breaker 2 is on leg 2, breaker 3 is on leg 1,
breaker 4 is on leg 2, etc.

To solve this type of issue you need a bridge. This allows the X10
signal to cross to the other leg. These can be obtain from most
Automation Hardware catalogs and HAL distributors. There are several
different types and your distributor can probably help you determine the
most appropriate one for your home.


If after installing a bridge you still have lights that will not
reliably get controlled regardless of which leg of electrical wiring it
is on then you probably have an X10 noise problem.

X10 noise can be created by devices in the house (or in fact outside of
the home) and can weaken the X10 signal. Quite frequently PC equipment
can cause X10 noise and you may find just moving the X10 PC to Powerline
Interface (PLI), that allows your HAL to send the X10 signal, to an
outlet away from your PC equipment will solve your problems. Use a
regular extension cord if needed. Beware of most surge protectors,
UPS's, and some (but not most) power strips. They can cause noise, or
block X10 signals so we do not recommend plugging your X10 PLI or X10
modules into these types of devices.

If that is not the issue then frequently other devices can cause the X10
noise, or the PC equipment may still be causing enough noise to weaken
the signal which then causes unreliable X10 transition. These can
include, but are not limited to, TV's, Florescent lights, washer/dryers,
air conditioner, etc. This noise can weaken the X10 signal making it's
transition to your X10 module less reliable.

If you find devices that are causing noise you can plug them into a
Noise Filter that can be obtained from most HAL Distributors. This will
stop the noise from getting on to the power line that was causing the
weakening of the X10 signal. If the device does not plug in they also
make noise filters that can be wired in. If you suspect that the noise
is coming from outside the home (this is rare) they do make a whole
house block. This device blocks this noise from getting inside your
home.

To determine which devices are causing noise you can unplug devices
(turning them off in a lot of cases in not good enough since when 'off'
they may still be on and thus creating noise). Then sending the X10
signal and seeing if it is more reliable. If so then 'probably' one of
the unplugged devices is causing noise. You can also use an X10 signal
strength meter to help determine when a signal is weak and when it is
stronger. These can be obtained from most HAL Distributors.

One way to speed up the search of noisy devices is to turn off breakers
within your home. Once off if the X10 transmits more reliably it
'probably' means that something on the breaker is causing the X10 noise.
Turn the breaker back on and try unplugging devices until you find the
one(s) that are directly related to the noise. Of course sometimes you
can have noisy device on multiple breakers.

Other hints are if your X10 used to transmit fine and all of sudden has
started to become more unreliable then did you just recently plug in new
devices, or is a device now running that was not before (such as the
heater, air conditioner, pool pump, etc). If so try unplugging/stopping
these devices and see if it is indeed related.

If you can turn a light on but not off it usually means that the light
itself is causing the noise (so now that it is on noise is created).
The noise is causing the X10 signal to weaken and not turn it off. Some
methods of fixing this is to use a noise filter between the X10 module
and the light or to use a higher end switch with AGC (Automatic Gain
Control) which helps the switch see the X10 signals better.

Other things you can do to help fix X10 noise problems without really
determining the source of noise is to use something that boosts the
signal. There are bridges that will repeat the X10 signal onto the
other phase thus strengthening the signal. There is also a plug in
booster that is made by SmartHome called a BoosterLinc. You can uses
X10 modules with AGC to detect the X10 more reliably.

Hopefully some of these details will help you track down your unreliable
X10 transition.

Tech Support
Greg

[Greg from HAL Support]

Here is the rest of my previous post:

If that is not the issue then frequently other devices can cause the X10
noise, or the PC equipment may still be causing enough noise to weaken
the signal which then causes unreliable X10 transition. These can
include, but are not limited to, TV's, Florescent lights, washer/dryers,
air conditioner, etc. This noise can weaken the X10 signal making it's
transition to your X10 module less reliable.

If you find devices that are causing noise you can plug them into a
Noise Filter that can be obtained from most HAL Distributors. This will
stop the noise from getting on to the power line that was causing the
weakening of the X10 signal. If the device does not plug in they also
make noise filters that can be wired in. If you suspect that the noise
is coming from outside the home (this is rare) they do make a whole
house block. This device blocks this noise from getting inside your
home.

To determine which devices are causing noise you can unplug devices
(turning them off in a lot of cases in not good enough since when 'off'
they may still be on and thus creating noise). Then sending the X10
signal and seeing if it is more reliable. If so then 'probably' one of
the unplugged devices is causing noise. You can also use an X10 signal
strength meter to help determine when a signal is weak and when it is
stronger. These can be obtained from most HAL Distributors.

One way to speed up the search of noisy devices is to turn off breakers
within your home. Once off if the X10 transmits more reliably it
'probably' means that something on the breaker is causing the X10 noise.
Turn the breaker back on and try unplugging devices until you find the
one(s) that are directly related to the noise. Of course sometimes you
can have noisy device on multiple breakers.

Other hints are if your X10 used to transmit fine and all of sudden has
started to become more unreliable then did you just recently plug in new
devices, or is a device now running that was not before (such as the
heater, air conditioner, pool pump, etc). If so try unplugging/stopping
these devices and see if it is indeed related.

If you can turn a light on but not off it usually means that the light
itself is causing the noise (so now that it is on noise is created).
The noise is causing the X10 signal to weaken and not turn it off. Some
methods of fixing this is to use a noise filter between the X10 module
and the light or to use a higher end switch with AGC (Automatic Gain
Control) which helps the switch see the X10 signals better.

Other things you can do to help fix X10 noise problems without really
determining the source of noise is to use something that boosts the
signal. There are bridges that will repeat the X10 signal onto the
other phase thus strengthening the signal. There is also a plug in
booster that is made by SmartHome called a BoosterLinc. You can uses
X10 modules with AGC to detect the X10 more reliably.

Hopefully some of these details will help you track down your unreliable
X10 transition.

Tech Support
Greg

[smit2519]

I had the phase problem with my place and didn't want to pay alot for electrical work. So I spliced 2 interface cables together, lengthened 1 and ran it into the next room and pluged them both into an interface on both legs of the house and then pluged those into outlets. Ta-da! I can now controle most of the X10 Modules I have.

However I still have come and go controle over 1 switch and 2 outlets. I can controle them sometimes and not other times. What could be causing this? I have even went so far as to unplug evrything in the house that was not using an X10 module (even the frig) and it still happens. Any ideas???
:(

[code monkey]

Hi steve, just an fyi. Using all caps in message boards or email is yelling.
Take Care,

CodeMonkey

[MichaelDStark]

I have a similar problem with my KeypadLinc Wall-Mounted X10 Controller. HAL isn't recognizing any buttons when pressed. The lights that I am turning on and off do get the signal just fine. HAL just doesn't seem to be changing the status of the light on the Device screen.

Also, I wanted to set up a few buttons as HOME, AWAY, SLEEP, etc. This is an easy way to tell HAL what mode to be in. This in turn would activate several macros. However, since HAL isn't recognizing any Device changes, this doesn't work either.

I have a SignaLinc Booster (4827) my latest attempt to fix the problem, Signal Coupler/Repeater (4820AC), SignaLinc (4816B2) and the device that keeps signals from other homes out of my home. None of which seem to solve this problem. I've even tried moving the SignaLinc Booster to other parts of the house.

I just can't figure out why the switch will activate my lights but will not change the status on the device screen.

I can't help but wonder if I'm missing something. Does anyone know anything about the KeypadLinc switch? Is there something I don't understand about the \"Primary Address\"? Should the \"Primary Address\" be the same or different than the main light that the switch is controlling? Right now the \"Primary Address\" is the same as my Dinning Room Light...should the \"Primary Address\" have it's own unique code?

Help if you can....please!

Michael Stark

[JimMcGowanInlet]

[quote:0436fe4ef5=\"MichaelDStark\"]I can't help but wonder if I'm missing something. Does anyone know anything about the KeypadLinc switch? [/quote:0436fe4ef5]

Yup I got them, they work great. First open up the HAL Monitor program and go to the data screen. Press the Keypad link's buttons and see what X10 codes HAL sees... if any. If HAL sees the codes then you just need to create an X10 Sensor for each X10 code/button

If HAL does not report the X10 codes on the monitor screen then your problem is not HAL its X10 signal not getting to your CM11a.

[AutomatedOutlet]

I think the only way you are going to troubleshoot this is with using a signal meter. I have free loaners available if you don't own one. I would also suspect a weak signal or noise.

[DevenLF]

I might want to try one of your loaners. I'm having the same problem with my Linc8. I have 10 of these in my home. They all work fine except for one. They RECEIVE signal from HAL or from other Linc8, but it doesn't send. I know they receive as the light status on the switch does change with the other switches. But, HAL OR the other Linc8's don't receive signal sent from this switch.

Ideas? Or maybe a signal meter would be helpful.

Oh, I do have a coupler and booster installed in the home.

Thanks,

Deven

[AutomatedOutlet]

Hi Deven,

Kind of hard to tell from here.

Did this ever work? Or did it just recently stop working?

The meter might be your best bet. If nothing else is receiving signals at all from the keypadlinc8, they perhaps the keypad is broken. I would try putting something on a lamp module on the same circuit as that keypad.

Program one of the buttons to trigger that lamp module. Do this just to make sure the the keypad isn't transmitting at all. If it's not transmitting at all, then I would replace the keypad. If it is transmitting, you might have something generating noise that is blocking the signals.

[DevenLF]

If I place a boosterlinc in the same room, and push a button on the keypadlinc8, the light on the boosterlinc flashes, which indicates that the keypadlinc is sending SOMETHING out. :-) But, it's not reaching any other switch or HAL.

Deven

[AutomatedOutlet]

Humm... I don't know if it's possible for it to send a bad signal or one that is a little off. Maybe.

Is there anything on that circuit that could be causing noise? Low voltage with electronic transformers?

Did that switch ever work right?